Electro? Electro-Funk?

  • Quote from daro;64829

    But kraftwerk are talking about station to staion all the LP
    Being a inspiration not just the title track,



    I agreed that "Station To Station" inspired TEE, but that doesn't explain why they decided to make it a dance record. You are arguing apples and oranges. :)

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64830

    I agreed that "Station To Station" inspired TEE,


    There you go after 8 or so posts of you waffling on you answered your own question, they
    In their own words, loved all the tunes on station to station,


    Are you still arguing oranges and apples.....


    Cozmo d On this topic ad nauseum

  • Bloody hell.


    I am gob smacked by the disrespect levelled at a pioneer. I don't know what to say.

    ELECTROFUNK is a subsidiary of HIP HOP MUSIC AND CULTURE, don't you forget it suckaz...

  • ELECTROFUNK is a subsidiary of HIP HOP MUSIC AND CULTURE, don't you forget it suckaz...

    ELECTROFUNK is a subsidiary of HIP HOP MUSIC AND CULTURE, don't you forget it suckaz...


  • wow thanks a lot!
    that was enlightening ... and it confirms a lot we have talked about in the last 5 pages.


    great thread btw ... i like reading all the different perspectives and opinions on the matter.

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64828

    We danced to it in Brooklyn. It rocked many a party. It was a breakbeat staple. ;)

    Just for information: when i wrote that with TEE Kraftwerk created electro and start produce more danceble music, some people wrote in response: What? Are you insane, how to dance to this music? KW is conceptual electronic group.... White people more concentrated on melody. :)


    And what are you guys want to find out in this topic? I read some interesting details, but they do not change nothing: KW was influenced by soul/funk, invited electro formula etc. - it's a fact, may be if KW don't do it, Juan Atkins do or sombody else, but i don't think so :)


    Is it possible that this composition was prototype of electro? what do think?


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  • Quote from daro;64834

    There you go after 8 or so posts of you waffling on you answered your own question, they
    In their own words, loved all the tunes on station to station,


    Are you still arguing oranges and apples.....


    Cozmo d On this topic ad nauseum


    Daro, is English your first language? If not, then I guess you have just been misunderstanding me. If it is, I guess that you are just trying to wind me up.


    My own question had nothing to do with "Station To Station", which has nothing to do with this thread. I said the first time that you mentioned it that I had read that as well, so on the point of being inspired by "Station To Station" we were in agreement from the start. But what I said immediately was that it was not "Station To Station" that inspired them to make dance music, as "Station To Station" was not a dance record, and it was the SONG (not the album) "Station To Station" that inspired the train theme for TEE. I now get the larger point that you are trying to make that the entire album inspired them, but that still is not what inspired them to make a dance record, as there is not a single dance cut on the "Station To Station" album, even though some of it is indeed danceable.


    And now, we have Karl Bartos' own words to back me up, that their intention WAS to make a dance record, and that they started adding more and more "funky" "Black beats" STARTING FROM TEE! So now you can go argue with and insult him! :D


    So... by way of their own description... and my understanding of the definition... I think that it is fair to say that tracks like "Trans Europe Express" and "Numbers" are indeed... Electro Funk! ;D

  • Quote from wex;64848

    Just for information: when i wrote that with TEE Kraftwerk created electro and start produce more danceble music, some people wrote in response: What? Are you insane, how to dance to this music? KW is conceptual electronic group.... White people more concentrated on melody. :)


    You (we) were right! ;D



    Quote from wex;64848

    And what are you guys want to find out in this topic? I read some interesting details, but they do not change nothing: KW was influenced by soul/funk, invited electro formula etc. - it's a fact, may be if KW don't do it, Juan Atkins do or sombody else, but i don't think so :)


    Is it possible that this composition was prototype of electro? what do think?


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaScyfSHc-Y


    KW did NOT invent Electro. They pioneered and indeed revolutionized it, but it existed before them. It was only a matter of time before somebody put some funky beats under it. In fact, there were already cats making funky electronic, synthesized music before them, though often with real drums and much less sequencing.


    As for a prototype of Electro, this springs to mind, but I believe that there are even earlier examples.


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  • Quote from Cozmo D;64852


    So... by way of their own description... and my understanding of the definition... I think that it is fair to say that tracks like "Trans Europe Express" and "Numbers" are indeed... Electro Funk! ;D



    You'll have to explain to Bhose though that thats not the "Electro-Funk" he has in mind
    when he's saying that "Electro-Funk is a subsidiary of Hiphop". :D


    If "Trans Europe Express" and "Numbers" are "Electro-Funk" then its rather "Proto-Electrofunk" in hindsight. 8)

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64853

    KW did NOT invent Electro. They pioneered and indeed revolutionized it, but it existed before them. It was only a matter of time before somebody put some funky beats under it. In fact, there were already cats making funky electronic, synthesized music before them, though often with real drums and much less sequencing.


    As for a prototype of Electro, this springs to mind, but I believe that there are even earlier examples.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OK5q1bU59Ic&feature=related



    I think the "Electro" he meant is not the "all of electro-nic music"-Electro,
    but the "what people on here would consider"-Electro. ;D

  • Quote from elektroakust.;64855

    You'll have to explain to Bhose though that thats not the "Electro-Funk" he has in mind
    when he's saying that "Electro-Funk is a subsidiary of Hiphop". :D


    If "Trans Europe Express" and "Numbers" are "Electro-Funk" then its rather "Proto-Electrofunk" in hindsight. 8)



    You've got to remember, I don't really understand ANY of these labels! I'll let you Europeans sort them out since it was y'all that came up with them! ;D


    As for Hip-Hop, I tend to agree with Bhose, that the break-rocking culture that sprang out of black music DJs in the early '70s likely inspired Kraftwerk to make dance music. For me, that was Hip-Hop... but there are a bunch of Bronx Hucksters who break down Hip-Hop into only 4 elements who would likely disagree... and since they invented the term... :D

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64857

    You've got to remember, I don't really understand ANY of these labels! I'll let you Europeans sort them out since it was y'all that came up with them! ;D


    As for Hip-Hop, I tend to agree with Bhose, that the break-rocking culture that sprang out of black music DJs in the early '70s likely inspired Kraftwerk to make dance music. For me, that was Hip-Hop... but there are a bunch of Bronx Hucksters who break down Hip-Hop into only 4 elements who would likely disagree... and since they invented the term... :D



    Well i don't know... but as far as Bartos and Flür (both doing the drumming and percussion)
    state their influences, it seems that listening to James Brown / Funk seems to have been
    enough to come up with these type of beats.


    I have no clue about non-electronic Funk, but didn't James Brown sing on broken
    funky beats before any Hiphop DJ started extending the instrumental "breaks"?
    If so, then i don't necessarily see a connection to Hiphop in Kraftwerks work
    untill maybe "Music Non Stop" (1986). By then they probably couldn't
    help but getting influenced in return by those beats in "Planet Rock" etc).

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64858

    How is that "Popcorn" track different from much of the "Electro" of early Kraftwerk? :)



    It isn't very diffrent from the very early Kraftwerk.
    Btw the original (1969) is a little better:
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    (Its by far not the first electronic music piece, but anyway... another topic.)



    I think most here start to make a difference in hindsight from "early electronic music" to "Electro"
    as soon as the music has some of the typical elements (like the beat in "Numbers")
    that you can still find in todays classic "Electro" formula (on here).
    But its all very subjective...


  • Of course, all of this is just conjecture, but my point was that Hip-Hop was changing ALL of dance music at the time, so it makes sense that it would have inspired Kraftwerk as well at the same time. SOMETHING inspired them to start making people dance. I suspect that being exposed to the American black culture in '75, when Hip-Hop was really starting to spread, inspired them to want people to dance to their music. Likely most of Radioactivity was already in the can, but the next new project they embarked on they decided to add at least 1 funky dance beat. That was TEE.


    Otherwise, why weren't they using James Brown inspired funky beats all along? Why the sudden change in '76?


  • OK... agreed. BTW, I was sure that there was an earlier version of "Popcorn" as I was quite young when I first heard it. Good digging. :)


    OK, further then on the original topic. What distinguishes "Electro" from "Electro Funk"? If "Numbers" is Electro, why is "Computer Age" Electro Funk? :)

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64862

    OK, further then on the original topic. What distinguishes "Electro" from "Electro Funk"? If "Numbers" is Electro, why is "Computer Age" Electro Funk? :)


    Numbers: More emphasis on the "weird electronic sounds" side of things. Beatwise, more emphasis on the mechanical, robotic quality.
    Computer Age: More emphasis on the groove. Huge emphasis on the bass (there is no bass on Numbers).

  • Quote from lj;64865

    Numbers: More emphasis on the "weird electronic sounds" side of things. Beatwise, more emphasis on the mechanical, robotic quality.
    Computer Age: More emphasis on the groove. Huge emphasis on the bass (there is no bass on Numbers).


    So, if "Numbers" had a bass line then it would be "Electro Funk"? Believe me, I tried like hell to get that robotic, computerized sound but there is only but so much you can do with a Pro One and an 808. ;D

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